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Using Categories for NGO pages

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An idea I have had is to add to each of the NGO pages some sort of categories like this:

[[Category: NGOs working in Kenya]] [[Category: NGOs working in Tanzania]]

And possibly this:

[[Category: NGOs working in Africa]]

We could add multiple tags to the same NGO page and end up with an easy way to create link in Country pages (Kenya, for example) like this:

[[:Category: NGOs working in Kenya]]

Or maybe it would simplify things to just do something like this:

[[Category:NGOs active in solar cooking promotion|Kenya]]

Possibly we could then link to the Category page like this:

[[:Category:NGOs active in solar cooking promotion#Kenya|NGOs active in promoting solar cooking in Kenya]]

What do you and Walter think about these ideas?

Tom Sponheim 00:02, 20 January 2007 (UTC)

The piped parameter in a category is never visible to the reader, as in [[Category:NGOs active in solar cooking promotion|Kenya]] . It is used only to index the article under "Kenya" rather than the title of the article. Only the "K" heading appears when viewing the category. Consequently, the wikilink, [[:Category:NGOs active in solar cooking promotion#Kenya|NGOs active in promoting solar cooking in Kenya]] won't work. [:Category:NGOs active in solar cooking promotion#K|NGOs active in promoting solar cooking in countries beginning with the letter "K"]] will work, but isn't what you want. Instead, I think (but really have no idea) that readers might be interested in a list of all content related to Kenya. Hence, [[Category:Kenya]] might be better. For countries with a lot of country specific content, subcategories could be created like [[Category:NGOs active in Kenya]]. Also, I'd suggest, based on Wikipedia experience, regional categories, as well as country categories, e.g., [[Category:Sub-Saharan Africa]]. That way, an article that applies to a region doesn't need to include all the country categories that comprise the region. Exploring Wikipedia:Category:Regions of Africa and its super- and sub-categories may be helpful.
Generally, a category is most useful with 10 to 50 articles listed. Fewer, and the category isn't very interesting. More, and it becomes hard to search manually. It may be helpful to refer to Wikipedia:WP:CAT and Wikipedia:Wikipedia:Overcategorization when defining new categories.Walter Siegmund 18:59, 20 January 2007 (UTC)
Thanks for the info. If you and Beth could come up with a system similar to what Wikipedia uses, that would be great. Tom Sponheim 19:18, 20 January 2007 (UTC)

OK, here's a proposal (trying to keep things simple):

  1. Let's have simple country categories, e.g. [[Category:Kenya]]. I had already put these on the vendor pages; we'd just need to add them to people, NGO, and country pages - and actually create the category pages, putting each one into the appropriate region (see next item). Then we'd also add a category link to each country page to show all the pages relating to that country.
  2. Let's create some region categories and make the countries subcategories of the appropriate region. For now, I suggest we just use the standard continents: Africa, Asia, Europe, North America, South America, and Oceania, which includes Australia & NZ. I don't suppose there's much solar cooking in Antarctica... If eventually we have many entries for subcontinents (e.g. Sub-Saharan Africa), we can work it in then.
  3. When the SCIA gets active on the wiki (note the optimistic use of "when" rather than "if" :) we can create two new regions to match their Ibero-America and Europe/Anglo America.
  4. Someday (perhaps soon) we'll create region pages...

Comments? --Beth Ogilvie 23:41, 20 January 2007 (UTC)

I want to be sure that somebody could be viewing an NGO page of an NGO working in Kenya, for example, and go to the bottom of that page and click a category that would take them to a page that shows only all of the othere NGOs working in Kenya.
I also want it to be easy to create a link from a Country page that points to all of the NGOs working in that country. I'm thinking that is cleaner to mark the leaves and have the grouping done automatically as much as possible.
Beth, would your proposal allow this?

Tom Sponheim 00:02, 21 January 2007 (UTC)

I think not, unless Wikimedia lets us combine categories, as in "Category=="Kenya" AND Category=="NGO", but I haven't seen any hint of that. Walter, am I right in thinking a category page can only display one category (or category hierarchy) at a time? --Beth Ogilvie 01:08, 21 January 2007 (UTC)
I'm wondering, though, if we really need a separate category page for the NGOs in a country, since they're currently listed on the country page - and the lists are short. Until the list gets inconveniently long, I suggest we just keep these lists on the country pages and not also have categories just for NGOs. If someday there are 50 NGOs promoting solar cooking in Kenya (wouldn't that be nice) we can create a category just for them. On the NGO pages, we can provide a link to the NGO section of the country page, or even just a link to the country page, at the top of which is a nice TOC with a couple of NGO entries. Could you live with this for now, Tom? --Beth Ogilvie 01:08, 21 January 2007 (UTC)
Yes, I can live with that. You're right. It might be overkill at the moment. Let's skip it for now. Thanks! Tom Sponheim 01:55, 21 January 2007 (UTC)

OK! Here's what I think we need to do:

  • Create the country category pages (currently in red on Special:Categories) and put them into the appropriate continent categories.
    • DONE. As I create more country categories, I'll create the category page right then.
  • Add the country category and country category link to Template:Country page.
  • Add the country category and country category link to all existing country pages.
    • DONE. Phew.
  • Add the country category (or perhaps region category) and country page link to all existing NGO pages.
    • When I do this, I think I'll add [[Category:NGO]]. Then we can have an alphabetical category page as well as the regional list at Non-governmental_organizations.

I'll get started. Walter, I'm assuming this plan is okay with you, since it's basically what you suggested... I think there's some clever way to use the page name as a variable so we can just paste the same couple lines into every country page. I'll figure it out. --Beth Ogilvie 17:47, 21 January 2007 (UTC)

I'll annotate the above list as they get done. --Beth Ogilvie 18:55, 21 January 2007 (UTC)
The above all looks good to me. Beth, a category page can only display one category (or category hierarchy) at a time, as far as I know. Some discussion has occurred recently on Commons that may be related to this, but I don't think anything has come of it. I think the plan you have implemented is a good one. The Kenya example looks good. The Kenya#See Also link is for people who don't know to navigate via the category links at the bottom of the page? It is redundant, but I suppose it could be helpful.
On Commons, the parent category of Africa is Commons:Category:Continents, which has a striking map that might be good here as well. I suggest making its parent Category:Browse for now. Walter Siegmund 04:26, 22 January 2007 (UTC)
{{subst:BASEPAGENAME}} will paste the name of this page, Using Categories for NGO pages, into a line of text. It may be helpful when performing a batch of edits or constructing templates. Other magic words exist. See Wikipedia:Help:Magic_words --Walter Siegmund 04:34, 22 January 2007 (UTC)
<blush>Until this moment, I was one of the "people who didn't know to navigate via the category links at the bottom of the page". It's obvious now you've said it... However I'm hoping a lot of people will use this wiki who aren't necessarily wiki-savvy, so I think it's ok to spell it out more.
I've put the continents into category Continents and made its parent Browse. To use the map Commons:Image:Continents_by_colour.png do I download it and upload it to Wikia? And if so, how exactly do I identify it? I find all these licensing options confusing. This one has both GFDL and "Creative Commons Attribution ShareAlike".
Thanks for the tip on magic words. I came across them yesterday. It's even simpler: {{PAGENAME}} will do the trick (for our simple page names). --Beth Ogilvie 21:54, 22 January 2007 (UTC)
I thought it was only me that was slow learning about categories. You make me feel better. Other things of the same sort on Wikipedia include:
  • ISBN 0962-95882-4 - Inline, usually in reference, lead to library and retail links for books.
  • Interwiki - Left sidebar, "in other languages", "Deutsch", "Français", etc., lead to the same article on other wikis.
  • Latitude and longitude coordinates - Infoboxes, lead to external links to maps and aerial photographs.
Please see Help:Copying from Wikipedia for guidelines on copying from Wikipedia and Commons. You should use the tags {{From_Wikipedia|}} and {{From_Commons|}} rather than our local tags for licenses, I think.
Another comment: Using {{subst:PAGENAME}} and {{PAGENAME}} have very different effects. The first construction substitutes the text that is designated onto the page when the edit is save. Upon re-editing the page, the substituted text appears, not the tag that generated it. The second results in the tag appearing in the edit window. Only when it is converted for display does the designated text appear. The former should be used whenever possible as its results are more obvious to novices and it reduces load on the server. Best wishes, Walter Siegmund 00:01, 23 January 2007 (UTC)
Thanks for that tip on template substitution! I changed Template:Country page but I won't change the country pages right now. I'm sure there will be a reason to go through them all again in the not too distant future, and we can do it then. Also thanks for the help on licenses. --Beth Ogilvie 18:11, 25 January 2007 (UTC)

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